Re: [Polat_Kaya] Words under the lens: English word "KNUCKLEHEAD".
Dear Gangchen Gonpo or Ganggon,
Hi! Thank you for your response regarding my paper on "knucklehead" being from Turkish "çok dangalak" meaning "very stupid". My response to your e-mail is below and citings from your letter are in red.
1. You said:
"With all due respect, knucklehead is not a disguised ancient Turkish word, unless someone did it during World War II."
Polat Kaya: I do not deny that the word "knucklehead" is a term used in the English language. I was explaining how this word was made up. There are many words of the English language that have been made up from Turkish words and phrases. I have been writing about this for quite some time. The term "knucklehead" is not an exception. Whenever it was made up (anagrammatized) does not matter. The important thing is that it has been made up from a Turkish saying and in my paper I explained how it was done.
Also, when you say that "knucklehead is not a disguised ancient Turkish word," will you please explain how you came to this very strong pronouncement? Surely you must have a rationale for your judgment. I would appreciate it if you would share that rationale with us. Obviously you know English but do you know Turkish? Do you know that there are endless numbers of words belonging to the so-called "Indo-European" (IE) languages that have been anagrammatized from Turkish words and phrases?
2. You said:
"What brings the HDAS to mind is that "knucklehead," meaning a stupid or slow-witted person, is classic US slang dating back to the period of World War II. Apparently "knucklehead" arose as a variant of "bonehead," meaning that a stupid person has a thick skull impervious to listening or learning."
Polat Kaya: What this is saying here is
that "all stupid" persons have "thick skull bones", and
that is why they cannot comprehend what people are telling them. This is
a baseless explanation and "etymology". Did it ever occur to you that
people use their "ears" to listen to what is being told to them?
People do not listen with their skull bones. Their inability to
understand what is being said can be due to so many different physical and
psychological conditions - but definitely not the thickness or thinness
of their skull bones! So your explanation again is far from being
satisfactory. It is a diversion and sophistication.
As for your saying "There's some evidence that "knucklehead" was originally military slang" again does not prove anything. In Turkish the use of "DANGALAK" meaning "stupid" is a general term that people use irrespective of being civil or military. It is a word that comes to present day at least from the times of the Ottoman empire. In other words, it has a long history in Turkish.
3. You also said:
(The word "knuckle," meaning the end of a bone at a joint, itself comes from a Germanic root meaning "little bone.") There's some evidence that "knucklehead" was originally military slang."
Polat Kaya: This implies that "knucklehead" is related
to the word "knuckle" which is said to come from the Germanic source "knöckel".
The make up of the Germanic source word for "knuckle" itself is suspicious though. The Collins German Concise Dictionary (German - English and "English - German), 1993, p. 250, defines "knöckel" as meaning "finger knuckle", that is, a "finger bone" - which it is.
Now let us analyze this German word "knöckel". When we look at this word in two parts such as "knöck + el", we have the following situation:
The word "EL" is the Turkish word "EL" meaning "hand".
The word "knöck" is nothing but the anagrammatized form of the Turkish word "KEMIK" meaning "bone". So, the German word "knöckel" is also a made-up word - anagrammatized from the Turkish expression "EL KEMIKI" (kemik + el) meaning "hand bones". Indeed the fingers and finger bones and the knuckles are the bones of the "hand", that is, EL in Turkish. Neither you nor any other linguist can deny this fact!
The English word "knuckle" is just another variation of the German word "knöckel", thus the English "knuckle" is also made up from Turkish "EL KEMIKI". You can see it inside "knuckle" if you look carefully.
The letter N in "knöckel" or in "knuckle" is the Turkish letter "M" encrypted (changed) into letter "N" by means of the so-called "Caesar Ciphering", see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Caesar_cipher. This is one of the encryption (camouflaging) tricks that has been widely used in manufacturing endless numbers of Indo-European words from Turkish words and expressions. Using this trick obliterates the original form and identity of the Turkish source material in the newly manufactured IE word. However I must point out that the original Turkish source text is still present in the newly manufactured IE word - although in a confused form. In other words, the original source text is not lost - meaning that it can be recovered - if one knows what to do. I have given countless numbers of IE word examples in my Polat Kaya Library.
Thus your referencing a Germanic word as a source for the English word "knuckle" does not help your argument either because both are manufactured from Turkish - contrary to all kinds of deceptive verbology! These 2 examples (i.e., English "knuckle" and German "knöckel") are, of course, in addition to the original "knucklehead" that I said was from Turkish "çok dangalak" in my paper.
Additionally, in German there is the term "Holzkopf" meaning "blockhead", that is, "wooden head" and not "bonehead". The German word "knöckel" does not seem to be used for referring to a "knucklehead". However, I will point out that the word "kopf", meaning "head", is nothing but an anagrammatized form of the Turkish word "kafa" meaning "head".
You can see now how solid my argument is about the makeup of the IE languages.
4. Furthermore, the Oxford American Dictionaries define the word "knuckle" with another meaning as follows:
"PHRASES: knuckle under the hostages agreed that they would not knuckle under surrender, submit, capitulate, give in/up, yield, give way, succumb, back down, admit defeat, lay down one's arms, throw in the towel, climb down, quit, raise the white flag."
The Oxford American Dictionary somehow connects the meanings of "surrender, submit, capitulate, give in/up, yield, give way, succumb, back down, admit defeat, etc., " with the finger bone "knuckle". Now, I ask you and all other linguists, to please tell me, how can anyone come up with a word that means all of these meanings with just the "finger bones"?
I will tell you, though, how they could have come up with these double meanings for this word: Actually the word "knöckel" is the combination of two different Turkish words (expressions):
One is the Turkish expression "EL KEMIK" as I mentioned above. The second is as follows:
The word "KNUCKLE" or "KNÖCKEL", rearranged letter-by-letter as "CUKLEN-K" or "CUKELN-K"is the anagrammatized form of the Turkish word "ÇÖKÜLEN" meaning "it is that which buckles under pressure, it gives way, it submits, it surrenders, it bends under pressure". Now that makes perfect sense as the basis for the English and Germanic word "knuckle" meaning "to surrender, bend, twist, curve, distort, contort, deform; bulge, arc, arch; crumple, collapse, give way".
So, in order for "knöckel" or "knuckle" to have these different meanings, the manufacturer of the word must have combined these two different Turkish sources into one word. Evidently these secret operators knew Turkish very well. They were definitely not knuckleheads.
To conclude, I say that your comments are a nice try of sophistry, but, of course, they cannot be accepted as an explanation for the term "KNUCKLEHEAD" as it is based on totally wrong information. My explanation of "knucklehead" being made up from Turkish "ÇOK DANGALAK" is logical, rational and powerful.
I do thank you for writing and sharing your views though.
By the way, it seems I received another letter from you once before - but under a different name, even though the e-mail user-ID was the same. Because of the change in your name, it was not easy to recognize you. The point I am trying to make here is that altering names and words are very effective ways of obliterating history and the identity of people.
Best wishes to you and to all,
Gangchen Gonpo wrote:
Hi,With all due respect, knucklehead is not a disguised ancient Turkish word, unless someone did it during World War II.According to 'The Word Detective'(http://www.word-detective.com/092403.html) dated Sept. 24, 2003, 'kucklehead' is a word that has only been around since World War II. The following is an excerpt from the webpage:"What brings the HDAS to mind is that "knucklehead," meaning a stupid or slow-witted person, is classic US slang dating back to the period of World War II. Apparently "knucklehead" arose as a variant of "bonehead," meaning that a stupid person has a thick skull impervious to listening or learning. (The word "knuckle," meaning the end of a bone at a joint, itself comes from a Germanic root meaning "little bone.") There's some evidence that "knucklehead" was originally military slang."Do you have any evidence that shows the word knucklehead has been used since ancient times after being 'stolen' from Turkish?ganggon<tntr@...> wrote:Here is an interesting word in English that needs to be explored for its make up. It is the English word "knucklhead" that means "a stupid person", [Oxford American Dictionaries]. When this English word KNUCKLEHEAD is rearranged letter-by-letter as "CUH-DANKELEK" or "CUK-DANKELEH"and the deciphered word is read as in Turkish, it becomes obvious that it is an anagrammatized and Anglicized form of the Turkish expression "ÇOK DANGALAK" meaning "very stupid, blockhead, knucklehead". Clearly, this Turkish expression "ÇOK DANGALAK" has been stolen and used to manufacture this English word KNUCKLEHEAD. Thus, this is another example that, regarding the authenticity of "Indo-Europan" languages, the Turks and the rest of the world public have been misled by the manufacturers and presenters of such languages. Of course, by such activities, not only are the Turkish language words and expressions stolen, but also the linguistic creations of the Turkish people, hence, Turkish civilization is stolen. This kind of stealing from the ancient Turanian language of Turkish and the ancient Turanian civilization has been going on since the time of the Babylonians, that is, for at least the last 4,000 years. The truth about world languages is not as it appears - or as it is presented to us. Linguistically, this cannot be ignored. It is time that linguists who work on the "etymology" of words to take note of this ongoing deception. Best wishes to all,Polat Kaya15/04/2010
--- On Thu, 4/15/10, Polat Kaya